Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals

[DROT]

Hello!

This is more so a question than suggestion, share how you feel concerning possibility of gang members joining Pro Cops.

It is important to understand what PC is and what possibilities the spawn realisitically brings, before jumping to any conclusions. PC is a group with primary focus on roleplay, portraying everyday policemen and initiating roleplay with criminals rather than immediately rushing for arrest. This goes for all spawns that become available to player that joins he Pro Cops group. Players using any PC spawn are obligated to attempt and roleplay with the wanted person before attempting arrest, with exception of events (sr/br/jb/turf).

What do Pro Cops have access to?

• More regular vehicles already available to trainees/state troopers.


• Nightstick, taser, shotgun, spray, similar to State Trooper - No lethal weapons and low ammo count.


• Dispatcher spawn, able to request from other cops to arrest a certain player, same function as K panel that all cops including trainees have - Can not arrest, has no weapons.


• Detective spawn, able to investigate script-spawned crime scenes - Can not arrest, has no weapons, roleplay spawn.


• Can spawn in some smaller towns.


• Dog spawn, increased running speed and bite effect slows the wanted player down, identical to rubber shotgun - Can not arrest.


• Can deploy stingers.

Overall, PC does not bring any powerful boosts to the player with exception of stingers that criminals are currently able to get access to via SAI membership. Its spawns are created to initiate or enchance roleplay situations, not to offer any real advantage to members over other players. The group fields many interesting scripts as of now unavailable to any other group/spawn, which however do not bring advantage over criminals.

What about rulebreakers?

It is widely known that PC disciplinary actions are borderline tyrannical with any sort of situation where the PC member abuses provided spawns/equipment or uses them in means not stated by PC rules, always ends with a kick or long term suspension. The only way to become member of PC is via minimum of four long weeks in SAPA with numerous tests completed, ending with another final PC test and probation period of one more month. All this taken into consideration, probability of any PC member taking the risk to try and abuse their spawn with high risk of losing it, is very, very low.
It is likely that PC is the group with lowest count of rulebreaks.

Why even think about it?

As should be evident by now, PC has access to variety to interesting roleplay-enchancing features. These features are currently available to a small number of players when taking general playerbase into consideration. Commonly we're able to see 30 cops online compared to 100 criminals. Only a few of those cops have access to PC, while the large majority of server (80%) can not even get a chance to join. Allowing gang members to take the same SAPA route and obtain PC would encourage more players to take on the roleplay of police officer. It is hard to think of a reason why players that decided to join a gang should not be able to roleplay as cops, or be limited to trainee/state trooper spawns, while PC is a group with exactly that purpose, giving players more roleplay material while offering no real advantage over the criminals. Additionally, groups like SAPA and PC itself may profit from increased activity.

Congratulations if you've made it this far, that was quite a bit of text to read!
Please have a thought about everything of the above and share your opinion.

[Bunny]

@Reggi

False. We are not allowed to deny crims from Desert Eagles, even if we would like to do so.

[Ramos]

No

[Joshbond]

@DROT said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

@Joshbond said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

why bother staying in a squad when you can join a gang and get ALOT more options for joining varied groups and still play as a cop...

You are saying this as if PC offers the same that squads do. Spawn-wise, PC is a State Trooper in a prettier skin with access to roleplay scripts. Do you see people leaving their squad to join a gang because they can spawn as State Trooper? Or do you presume that squad members only stay in their squad because of PC membership? Common practice is getting PC only to improve chances to join a squad.

You are missing the point Drot.

Why would any squad member or new potential squad members want to stay/join a squad when they can join a gang and get access to WAY more than what they can in a squad. As a crim you can get PC, DE, Secret Service, OB, CLO and the list goes on. But as squad member you get hmm DE,SAI, PC oh wait I can get those while being part of a gang so I can than do more.

Its a no brainer. This is what I mean about after effect. Squads will start to die.

[Paradox]

@Joshbond you get HLS bro but dont worry crims will join to it soon

[Cappo]

Nope, -1, that makes no sense.

First of all, it makes no sense at all. Criminal, that has membership in an official gang to be part of SAPA or SAPD.
Second of all, the criminals that are interested in experiencing the cop side can join SAI, moreover, currently, SAI is more oftenly used to roleplay than PC spawns. (even though SAI isn't that active). I mean, the PC spawn isn't used for roleplaying at all, spawns like the Police Dog (even though it got a nice buff) and the detective are not used. As Ardron said, the PC spawn is used only from the unofficial squads and also from the cops during a JB. So yeah, there's no roleplay at all, I also have a nice feeling that as if criminals are able to join it, we'd do the same exact thing to simply farm money, instead of roleplaying, as the roleplaying could be done as SAI anyways.

If you're a criminal and you want to have some roleplaying fun as a cop, simply apply for SAI, joining PC wouldn't make any sense as in roleplays, both of the groups are familiar.

[Kim]

-1

[Skerdi]

What about a group called pro or elite criminals :P oh wai dis makes no sense

[Bozi]

AAPD could be real :D

[Kleptix]

a big NO,

if one can't see the obvious I'm sorry for him and will explain it cuz I'm good man.

ONLY reasson for doing this is to increase PC activity. so if you do the "pros&cons" in best situation you get only one positive feature - and take in consideration it is not a 100% that this would increase activity. (crims can't follow server rules and if you add strict PC rules the whole hell will break loose)
So the simple math tells you that is noth worth it.

on a more serious note then what is is already; it would really kill the professional cops idea of a group.
Criminals can already join sai, de, spawn as trooper etc etc, PC doesn't really open something new for them.. let's wait for CEM and CLO to start recruiting cops, who knows maybe there is a lot of cops that would like to abuse something also

[Stay]

yeah it doesn't matter if we're voting 'NO' yet admins want it they'll have it, /me looks forward the horizon as he would grab his Bandana & ak47 vato

[Skerdi]

@Stay said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

yeah it doesn't matter if we're voting 'NO' yet admins want it they'll have it, /me looks forward the horizon as he would grab his Bandana & ak47 vato

Admins? I thought this was in hands on sapd hq , which has admins in it but you get my point

[Stay]

@Skerdi said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

@Stay said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

yeah it doesn't matter if we're voting 'NO' yet admins want it they'll have it, /me looks forward the horizon as he would grab his Bandana & ak47 vato

Admins? I thought this was in hands on sapd hq , which has admins in it but you get my point

couple admins that i wont name, are cheering for it, so yeah there u got your answer. now i'll retire from this topic.

Whatsoever happens with this good luck

[Exclusive]

I personally feel like there should be more of a divide between cops and crims. I dont believe any gang memebers should have any affiliation with police force what so ever. Crims just want to hang on to some authority which I think is wrong. Mainly I feel like it should be this way as SAES is actually a RPG server. Thats just my thoughts though.

[DROT]

@Stay said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

yeah it doesn't matter if we're voting 'NO'

Indeed it doesn't because this isn't a vote, it is a question. We're asking for your opinion, not your vote.
If I ask you how you feel about the rain, that doesn't mean that you get to choose whether it will rain or not.

The goal of this topic is to find out what the playerbase thinks about this subject, nothing more, nothing less.

[Kleptix]

@DROT many people got triggered, it means they care.

[DJO]

-1

[BusterMcBadass]

I dont mind at all, its cool that everyone can get a chance at doing something.
I dont think it affects anyone's gameplay at all.
I also understand why the cop side is feeling very offended by this but why would someone getting a god damn diploma affect the way you play at all? In my point of view I think everyone should be able to do what they enjoy. I saw some people ask oh so can cops join clo now too? well, I dont know but I wouldnt care about that either!
Arent we all here to have fun?
So how about we ask the question differently? Should any person playing in SAES:RPG be given the chance to TRY and get a Pro Cop diploma?.

I dont want anyone to take this comment personally, these are just my thoughts and Id appreciate if you gave me yours too.

[Marko.]

@BusterMcBadass said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

RPG

[BusterMcBadass]

@Marko said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

@BusterMcBadass said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

RPG

AFAIK you can have different characters in RPGs.

[Henry]

It should be fine for people to have access to different groups which are aparently enemies, aslong as they can play different characters, otherwise nope.

[Pegasus]

@DROT said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

It is sad to see that the leader of a squad completely misses the point of PC diploma. It was NEVER intended for ALL players, only for COPS that were willing to get certified for a better chance in a squad. People joined SAPA only because they either wanted to become an instructor or to move on to an elite squad(lvl 4,5).

Speaking of missing the point, you just aced it. If this was the case and PC existed only to easily join a squad or an organization, we may delete the PC spawn entirely and just give people a forum title instead.

PC has dozen of scripts made specifically for cop roleplay, not for you to get into a squad easier.

Ever read what others type instead of bashing replies? Which part of my comment says that PC only exists to join a squad? I said it was INTENDED for cops and not all players.
Furthermore, where exactly have I mentioned that it makes it easier for a person to get into a squad with PC? I mean obviously it would be easy if squads free invite people, and you know what I'm referring to, but it does not make it easy for people to join a squad, it makes the person more qualified.

[DROT]

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

Ever read what others type instead of bashing replies? Which part of my comment says that PC only exists to join a squad? I said it was INTENDED for cops and not all players.

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

It's main purpose was never RPing, but to show that a person was familiar with the law enforcement side and had enough experience before they joined a squad.

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

It was NEVER intended for ALL players, only for COPS that were willing to get certified for a better chance in a squad.

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

People joined SAPA only because they either wanted to become an instructor or to move on to an elite squad(lvl 4,5).

Now as for your latest randomly capitalized word, it doesn't matter what it was INTENDED for.

Your parents didn't intend on having you until one day they did.
In 2010 special police spawns were not intended to become squads, until one day they did.
DDT was not made with intention to become CeM, until one day it did.
Trucking scripts were not were not intended to become trucking vol.2, until one day they did.
Tractor was intended for farming, until one day in WW1 some guy turned it into a tank instead.

I could go on for hours listing all the things that were not INTENDED for this or that, but became something else with time. The sole fact that sometime in the past someone did not intend to do something, is not an argument as to why it shouldn't happen in the future.

The topic provides you with a very simple question but you'd rather make it hostile and personal for whichever reason.
I will gladly discuss with you given that you come up with an actual argument and manage to keep track of what you wrote yourself.

[Human_]

You can all keep PC to yourself cops, aslong as I get to keep my precious @Tut-Greco

[Pegasus]

@DROT said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

Ever read what others type instead of bashing replies? Which part of my comment says that PC only exists to join a squad? I said it was INTENDED for cops and not all players.

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

It's main purpose was never RPing, but to show that a person was familiar with the law enforcement side and had enough experience before they joined a squad.

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

It was NEVER intended for ALL players, only for COPS that were willing to get certified for a better chance in a squad.

@Pegasus said in Pro Cop (PC) for Criminals:

People joined SAPA only because they either wanted to become an instructor or to move on to an elite squad(lvl 4,5).

Now as for your latest randomly capitalized word, it doesn't matter what it was INTENDED for.

Your parents didn't intend on having you until one day they did.
In 2010 special police spawns were not intended to become squads, until one day they did.
DDT was not made with intention to become CeM, until one day it did.
Trucking scripts were not were not intended to become trucking vol.2, until one day they did.
Tractor was intended for farming, until one day in WW1 some guy turned it into a tank instead.

I could go on for hours listing all the things that were not INTENDED for this or that, but became something else with time. The sole fact that sometime in the past someone did not intend to do something, is not an argument as to why it shouldn't happen in the future.

The topic provides you with a very simple question but you'd rather make it hostile and personal for whichever reason.
I will gladly discuss with you given that you come up with an actual argument and manage to keep track of what you wrote yourself.

Let me take care of the paucity of your brain-cells. It's clear that you're not familiar with how English works so let me tell you what those sentences actually mean. As far as you saying "Your parents didn't intend on having you until one day they did", that is exactly how I expect you to behave, so thank you for attesting to it.

There is a difference between "Main purpose" and "No purpose", what I meant to say that it wasn't created for your aforementioned reasons but shared a different purpose, however, that does not mean RP can't be it's secondary purpose so try coming up with an argument instead of twisting things and randomly bold-quoting me.
In regard to your INTENDED points, irrespective of what the initial intention was, the suggestion bears no fruit and brings nothing to the table except activity. What you don't care about, or seemingly cannot process, is the repercussions of this idea on the law enforcement side (ironic).

It is clear by the votes about how many people disagree to this, and I can give you in writing that if this suggestion is implemented, a large proportion of the law enforcement side is going to lose the will and/or the motivation to work hard.

Oh and also, thing topic is neither hostile nor personal, it is completely related to what I've said throughout. You are the one who jeopardized PC by randomly inviting people into your squad (blacklisted ones too oops), you killed the motive of PC because irrespective of the qualification of the person, you didn't care, so it is really ironic to see it coming from you.

[blizzard]

I've had this discussion with someone some time before this thread started and I knew it would end up with cops crying over their diploma, over the fact that they can't join CLO, OB etc.

The truth is, as far as I am concerned, PC Diploma is given by SAPD, which is a group itself, so all of this is up to the group's HQ, as they are the ones giving it away.

A more logical way for gang members to play as a cop rather than a trainee / state trooper / sai is... make a cop group. Yeah, hard to think about it? If Gang Members want to make a group that acts like a squad, attends BR's and so, and welcomes gang members, there is no one stopping you. Aslong the group really is active and realy shows what they want, I see no problem.

Same goes for the cops, who stops you from creating a criminal group that lets cops in? DE CLO, OB, SAI, HLS are groups and they made their decisions who they want to let in. If you want the contrary, just make another group.