GM Questionnaire: Why are you not a cop?

[DROT]

It's widely known that the police team has seen a decrease in numbers over the years, and in an effort to potentially better understand the causes behind the issue in order to choose adequate solutions, we ask you the following question:

Why are you not a cop? Or rather, why are you a criminal instead?

There are many people and many reasons, what is yours? We're not asking what you think should be done about this problem, or what you think why other people don't play as cops, why do YOU personally choose to be a criminal instead? Perhaps it is something unique and positive about the criminal side or something negative about the police one. Maybe it about the players, a combination of many things or something entirely different. Even if it's not something that you think we can affect or was already said by someone else, your comment may provide us with valuable information.

Whichever your personal reason may be, please let us know in a comment below.

[Absent]

I've been a cop for a lot of time and I used to enjoy it, because it always brought you a challenge how to handle more than one criminal at once since we all know that cops have always been outnumbered. That situation hasn't really changed much, however, it has been made really easy for cops to arrest people, which I dislike. Not only that, but the police community itself has changed a lot. The squads have never really worked together, there has always been this rivalry between all of them, while gangs always do stuff together even if they are enemies in turfs. In the criminal community you are a friend of everyone, while in the squad community you are a rival of everyone. That's how I see it.

Another problem is that the RP is gone. In my opinion, the people who are in squads enjoy more RPing than those in gangs, who enjoy more " DMing ". Since RP is kind of gone in the server, it brings less joy being a cop. Homeland Security, the best group back in the days, has turned into a squad with armor that spawn for BRs. That's probably one of the biggest dissapointments for myself.

About the favourism thing which Teddy mentioned, it's probably true nowadays. But I personally haven't seen anyone saying " join us and we offer you this and that ", althought I have heard rumours, yeah. I cannot deny the fact that there is favourism everywhere, not only in cop side.

Desert Eagles as a group is another topic and I don't really think it should be discussed since DE has never been CLO and CLO has never been DE. You cannot compare two different groups with different politics. DE has always depended on CLO and has always been more focused on RPing. CLO on the other hand has more freedom, that's true, and they are more involved with the community. That doesn't mean that DE cannot be involved with the community, as well. I believe, the whole problem comes again from the fact that cop side players are rivals, as I've already said, and they are simply not working together. DE has always been allowed to respond upon any SAPD request. That means a simple " We need DE assistance somewhere " in the radio - DE can respond, but people are just not used to that. The other issue is the RP, as I've already mentioned. It's no longer an interest to many people in the server.

In conclusion, I switched to criminal side, because the police community is no longer what it used to be, lack of challenge with the new arresting system and because you can be more combat involved when being a criminal ( mainly turfs ).

[Puppy]

@matizz said in GM Questionnaire: Why are you not a cop?:

• Reset economy

This would be a good start in my opinion, reset the economy, make money harder to get, I think it would be a good challenge and you'd have something more to work for.

• Rescript all scripts

This is borderline impossible since most, if not all, SAES scripters do their work for SAES in their free time(or so they say).

• Bring RP


• Add realistic to server

They could add/make something to help things out with RP/Realism but I doubt they will since 80% of the players on SAES either can't be asked to RP or they just don't know how. I'd personally love to see something be done about the RP portion on the server but the chances of that happening are very low.

• Add voice chats

Yes, because everyone wants to hear 20 people in the same internet coffee shop thing yelling into their microphone. Also, you have to take into consideration that some people don't know even basic English let alone make proper sentences and last more thing to add is most people just use Discord to talk to their friends when playing SAES/other games. So, yeah, I wouldn't see how this would be a good thing.

• Remove all donation vehicles and add something new for donators (bcz its make lags i think)

Honestly, this wouldn't be a bad idea, there are way to many donation cars on the server and I can see how people with lower end PCs can lag.

• Add limit gangs/squads/groups on the server for example 5 gangs 5 squads no more

This also wouldn't fix the current situation on SAES between the cops and criminals. Also just imagine the admins deleting your whole squad/gang if this happens. People would rage. So no.

• Add inventory system with trades etc (as i said like in GTA 5 RPs servers)

Adding an inventory system to SAES would be a great idea, both for cops and crims and also for the RP side of things. For example, cops could search criminals for illegal goods, get it sent to an evidence locker which possibly could be another activity for criminals. On the criminal side of things. let's say a gang goes to rob a bank, they could put money bags in their inventory and take it to their hideout and later on get it distributed equally between the active participants of the bank robbery.

[Law]

Let's start I was in both sides before, when I start game try play criminal was hard and all time arrested 420 seconds, so I try cops side was easy one to play and starting play in server

as cop, you have toys very power to catch any criminal like taser gun -shotgun - flash- k panel, and your spam until you arrest your target so main RP only arrest in Br Sr VIP old kings home not new trash jail

But in that time no one learn me anything about how to use all what I mention just rules and hanging few times like 30mint in day and all day boring AF same thing every day Sr VIP Br only one thing I was wait for it JB cause more fun and money rise my stats action all time.
Kings home old one was being stable for both sides criminals can hold it more time for more action and fun for each side even try new tricks while JB is on but
new jail is made only for cops side even 5 trainers can rip +20 criminals in it why a lot of markers gates and secret passages to control roam and red gate even marker red cell is EZ to hunt who stand there so its EZ to rip any JB fast without need HLS or DE helping
so what cops doing now after no JB all time cause of it
add new things to make cops side be EZ more is made cops side be boring with time and near to rip
so what left to cop Sr BRS VIP

2:: Sr same thing every day no new boring even for both sides for years now we made topics change Sr grab old Sr with new one or create something new but not like new jail make it stable for both sides even change Sr looks like in every city but no new so what left VIP Br

3: VIP no fun in it why cause just grab VIP in lvpd
when criminals can't enter it boring and same VIP system every time we need to change or add new thing to it too

4: BRS only one thing left after new jail left but even these admins killed it
make new markers in lobby in big banks new scripts AFK + 10 squad req

only 6 banks and reset every 6h so as IAM cop must wait until banks be able every 6h and gangs regrouping and start Br to go to bank
boring AF and no team work inside cops side only use radio
no tactic how to rush or kill criminals inside and rise your skill with cs and flash tricks and use your brain not run and die all time

No rps in cop side as all see money transporter is boring not add anything to cops side we made topics for add to cops more rps like they can turf with us and make arrest time less +even make cops can crack safes of gangs in bases like gr Gangs have with new rules for it lot of ideas for rise cops side but no one try even listen to me or anyone like we're talking to wall.
Make cops side harder no fun to play in easy mode all love hard one make it easy more and more be boring AF after while that is why I see a lot of squads members left and came to gangs.

From all my talks mean no teamwork between squads all try to have achievement to him self don't think about big goal to rip Br or Sr VIP JB
as one big team name of it cops side.

Hope see changes in server soon about give us back old jail or made new jail stable for both sides
2: made more banks and made low time to reset

3: fix lag in server it's hard for all of us

4: fix bugs like all time need press fix gun even for fist DMG or can't jump and cops hit he can't arrest cause must fix gun silly bugs

5: rise more rps to cops I mention few, and I see the lot of topics with more ideas.

6: make cops side harder for being fun don't make it easy with new rules new jail new markers that is killing it

7: Admins be nice with new players even old cause few admins not all of them feel like they want to use his power as admin to make you kneel to him this is bad AF.
as Admin must show more respect to all and help all even if anyone did something wrong and want to punch him do it but learning him to not do it again and show him respect even if he is not showed it to you cause you present server not only your self

Hope in the end see new things change for the best of our server

[Dawis67]

Im writing this without reading other comments, so i may have forgotten to add some good points others have written, but its not so important anyways in that case.

I started out as a cop. That was back in 2014. Yes there were more criminals than cops even back then but it was way more balanced. I for one fell in love with the balance of RP and casual gameplay elements on this server in general. Back in 2013 squads used to do a lot more RPs. For example cops would give warnings before shooting cars, etc.

When i found out about SAPA and that there was a way to stand out from other noob cops and gain respect by getting ProCop diploma (PC) i was dedicated to that task right away. The amount of work you had to put in to getting it was in the end satisfying for the reward: people gave you respect. They knew that as a PC you wouldnt arrest without RP, and crims were much more relaxed and wouldnt DM as much around you. Eventually i did break a rule in PC for, i think it was not doing RP. Well its a long story if i was gonna go into details, and i have forgotten most of it anyways, but i felt like i was unfairly punished by being removed from PC and i slowly turned criminal. This was around time i also lost interest in playing SAES in general and went on/off inactive for many years.

During my time as PC i attempted to create two police squads, SASS and SABS. Didnt work out in general due to my lack of knowledge of the effort and management skills required. Failed because of shitty HQ members. I think later on i joined FBI or TST or something, dont quite remember. Then as i mentioned earlier i went inactive.

I think the reason why i eventually left cops is because i got bored of the skill-based gameplay. Playing as a cop was always all or nothing game. You either arrest the criminals or you get nothing. Criminals would always bunch up together and help eachother and they would always get rewards without needing much effort. Arresting takes effort but standing in a SR circle and waiting doesnt. You essentially get the same amount of money.

I think this is what it came down to for me. As im writing this this notion is being affirmed in my mind. It was much easier to earn money as a criminal. You go somewhere, stand and wait, and get money. You also had a good comradery, as criminals would work together to help eachother, as it was in their best interests to kill the cops. As a cop most of what you did came down to arresting and being quick and skilled enough to take shots, avoid criminals and hope the baton hits register, as sometimes you would arrest with 1 hit, and other times you would hit like 5 times and still wouldnt arrest. This was frustrating for me. I saw how chill you could play this game as a criminal and it was what i was looking for.

Solution:
I think this is true to this day. Im not entirely sure what new money earning ways cops have nowadays, but for the most part, i still see even skilled squad members mostly getting lucky on arrests and using different techniques, either by ramming a plane into SR or jumping with bikes on the SR roof and hoping for the best.
I think cops should also get a more passive way to earn. Maybe a way that cops can wait in circle, and criminals have to do the skill-based effort. I know there are a lot of players that want a challange, and i agree, it can be fun, but not always. If you only rely on arresting criminals for money, you not only increase the rivalry between cops but also make it not so fun to play if you just want to relax and earn money.

Note: I havent played as a cop since i quit, so my opinions about current situation are based on my experience with playing as a cop in the past, and my encounters with cops as a criminal.

TLDR:

• I used to play as a cop, but stopped.


• Cops RP gone. Most squads just arrest.


• Little to no comradery in squads / police side


• Being a cop is either too hard or too easy. This is IMO due to cops not having leisurely income methods such as SR for criminals.

After reading some other comments:

• The main thing i see people mention is that cops are too harsh to new players with their arresting rules. As a criminal its really annoying to have a cop do the RP or sur binds and never give change for RP or sur. Its pointless. The whole RP thing for cops is dead.
  I can understand new players dont wish to RP or dont even know how, which brings me back to how i started. I was a noob trainee, arresting for 1 star, etc didnt RP. But i saw the respect PC players had back in the day. Ill give you that i was somewhat interested in the RP aspect as well, but even so the PC was something for all noob cops to reach for.

[Immortal]

I'd like to suggest these stuff which may affect squads activity and cops activity in general in a good way

• Reduce the time required to start another SR

One of fav activity that I do really like doing is when I'm spawned as a cop, which is raiding SRs especially the ones which full of criminals, with reducing jail time, of course, that's what I really enjoy personally when spawned as a cop.

• Add more stores to rob / add HR back again

HRs were really fun too back there, raiding it with helicopter etc.., It's really fun, also It's going to add various modes to the game to not get us bord (should be like sr>hr>sr..)
watch this>> youtube.com/watch?v=UVjtY2Tex-c

• Getting back old jail map

It is very noticeable that after adding the new one and jailbreak activity decreased recently, also there is no fun on the new one, I don't know how cops accepted that, for me on big JBs on the old map, I used to spawn as Warden trainee, to farm kills/money, and I was able to achieve like 600k in 15 mins which was awesome, I couldn't find anything to enjoy on the new one added.

• Talking about Taser

You can add something like shooting head = instant arrest, of course with reducing taser range or it going to turn to a real sniper

• Bring back old BR system

It's one of the great activity that I really enjoy doing when I was playing as a cop, which was about raiding gangs while they are regrouping, also the side shooting between me and criminals on the other side, you already added something like killing criminals inside banks will result of instant jailing him, you may not allow criminals anymore to defend lobby, and this will give cops good advantage to show some of their skills etc.., with reducing the amount of HLS who are attending the BRs, like 2-3 max who's only allowed to attend the bank robbery, you can also ask some of the current pro squad members on the other side, they didn't even like the new system.

• Give squads the ability to turf and defending their turfs

I am pretty sure this gonna buff squads activity especially if you gave them the abilities we have like headshots etc..., without allowing them to arrest for sure, I mean like a taser should work as a normal weapon when they have /war on or something.

Last, I want to mention something, please remove the useless rules found on the server, and just leave the main ones, talking on both sides, also for squads HQs, please teach your members to enjoy the game without reporting every single case, I don't know, on past days people like Sherap and Aluis dat TST guy were the most hated persons on the server cause they were reporting every singe rule break they see, and ended up getting a permanent ban for both of them, and nowadays all cops on the server are acting the same even worth.

[DROT]

To clarify one more time, this is not a suggestions topic. We're only interested in hearing about why you're not a cop.

For any suggestions, please head to appropriate forum section.

Also thanks to everyone so far for sharing their reasoning with us.

[DROT]

The topic will remain active for the next 4 days. If you have not yet commented and intended to do so at some point, please do as soon as possible.

All comments are and were taken into consideration, and we are more than satisfied with the vast amount of feedback!

[brondy]

I've been playing criminal since 2013. I've never played on the police side. I've seen the police side sound fun at times, but I've realised it's not long-term fun. As a criminal, there are so many activities we can do in the game and we can do them alone or as a team. It's always been attractive to me to run away from the police and clash with them instead of chasing people on the police side. I'm still a gang member on this server and I'll probably remain a criminal until my career is over. I think I have some respect as a criminal by people, and it gives me pleasure to think that I played a leading role in some activities (such as bank robberies). As @Rake said, If you're playing on a police side, you have to work as a team, but that's how you can enjoy it. Sometimes it can be more enjoyable for people to be alone, and we can do that on the crime side.I have about 6100 hours on this server, and I would say I spent it all as a criminal. I hope the balance of the number of criminals and cops equalizes each other and everyone plays a more enjoyable game

[Teller]

Low skillgap and overall police side of community is bitches. /me drops the mic

[bas260]

---

@cappo

• The cop community in my eyes is more mature than the criminal community. That's just my opinion, I haven't been in a gang or a criminal ever. And the binds that I wouldn't call autistic are something that I only see gangs using and spamming. It's one of the reasons I never felt attracted to a gang. I've also never myself experienced what you call flexing from squads. I do believe there are too many squads. And that making new ones is futile.


• On your second point. I haven't read all the replies to this topic. But I would just like to point out that the only two cop groups in the game are PC and SAI.
  A police group would be put in the https://saesrpg.uk/category/28/response-policing-group-rpg section of the forum.

---

@ILLUSION I really enjoyed reading your feedback. I agree with almost everything you said. As someone whose been a cop my whole life I enjoy the following as a cop. The role and the relentless chase I enjoy that. Trying to arrest people and dying doesn't bother me at all. The only thing as a cop that I would enjoy is nerfing vehicle speeds to levels where cop cars can keep up with civilians cars and seeing the helicopter be used again. All the heliports are basically empty .

---

@nicus I could definitely be someone who's said something like that. I didn't enjoy the bank robberies. Just the sheer amount of criminals and SWAT spawn not having spray. FFS @DROT That would keep me from going to bank robberies. And the not willing to work together as squads because someone doesn't like the other person is a crazy thought also. But yeah it happens in squads.
Also, the afking is annoying as fuck. I'm narcoleptic I can fall asleep during gameplay and I can't do anything about it. But some people knowingly leave their PC on as a cop and then you call them and they're not there. Then I just end up spawning as SAI.

---

@Malaleche use gunfix more often :)

---

@Kuby @Kuby Stealing arrests is not a thing. Only justice haha.

---

@Teddy

• 
  

  There's a general attitude of; if you can't beat them, report them. I've never heard this on the cop side in the 7 years I've played. And this is information you as an admin-only have about the reports. Maybe you're biased because of it. And it's up to an admin to decide whether it was a punishable offence or not. If you'd say something like this to a very insecure new cop he'd probably be afraid to report someone. And criminals maybe it's because criminals are more comfortable with rulebreaking than cops. That's why they are criminals? Who knows?

  
  


• 
  

  Why is the PC spawn locked? in my opinion, because it spawns with rules and a certain level of maturity is expected of you. And if you open up the PC spawns to anyone it would hurt squads and groups. Why would you be in a squad or try to join SAI if you can have the same abilities in a public spawn.

  
  


• 
  

  And criminals can and will always be able to join SAI as long as I'm in the Leadership. Because it would be crazy not to allow the majority of the server into a group.
  *The criminals in cop groups problem; this is directly from GM. Not quoted but something like the following is written down somewhere. A group maybe not be some sort of squad for criminals. And the other way around it's also not possible.

  
  

---

@Bones How is the gameplay for a cop humiliation to yourself or sad for that matter? That's just a dumb statement. If you were online late and spread that around surely no new player or friend of yours would ever consider being a cop.
It's a choice if someone wants to play as a cop. This just adds to my first reply to cappo about gangs not being mature at all. In my opinion.

---

@Leonard I must say that in my own experience you're incorrect. If I see trainees running around and they are not gang members (who change their name which is incredibly dumb just keep your own nickname). I would teach them how to play the game introduce them to it a little. Find someone from their own country. Tell them what they should try to join if they want it. Just ask @dobroski I helped him when he first joined. Same with @nvidia.

I also think it's important you're welcomed to the server by someone either your own age or someone who is mature and helpful.

The cop side has tactics also. A lot of cops aren't willing or there jaren't any cops to teach. xD

---

@Teller best pause feedback pause ever..

[Teddy]

Was about to log on SAES but there's 91 players at 17:00 on a Saturday so I'll use my time here instead as I forgot to reply:

@bas260 said in GM Questionnaire: Why are you not a cop?:

• The cop community in my eyes is more mature than the criminal community. That's just my opinion, I haven't been in a gang or a criminal ever.


• On your second point. I haven't read all the replies to this topic. But I would just like to point out that the only two cop groups in the game are PC and SAI.

HLS? DE? SS? SAPD?

They ain't gangs...

Compared to criminals having CLO and well, technically OB, though that's dead. A ratio of 2 v 6 at least.

@Teddy * There's a general attitude of; if you can't beat them, report them. I've never heard this on the cop side in the 7 years I've played. And this is information you as an admin-only have about the reports. Maybe you're biased because of it.

I mean that's not a point of bias is it? Just an observation anyone with an admin panel can make. Cops massively outweigh criminals in reports per day while making up a small minority of the server. Hence I don't even agree with the initial "maturity" point because a large amount of crim players would agree that many cops only play-to-report.

• Why is the PC spawn locked? in my opinion, because it spawns with rules and a certain level of maturity is expected of you. And if you open up the PC spawns to anyone it would hurt squads and groups. Why would you be in a squad or try to join SAI if you can have the same abilities in a public spawn.

Why do you think people join OB? They have no extra abilities over any other criminal spawn which can also jailbreak. Or SAP? It used to be an extra teamchat at best, nothing more. People join these groups because of the camaderie and the availability of like-minded people to play around with, that's what made them special & active.

PC is neither a special spawn or a "mature" spawn, and has nearly never been. For most of its history SWAT completely ignored whether somebody was a member of PC because in reality it made no difference to their application or how they are viewed as a person/player, and made little effort to push people inside the group. There was of course bonuses if people were part of SAPA, but for different reasons.

It is a redundant "group" in a group sense, and only serves to lock 80% of cop abilities behind disused classes. Opening up PC to the public would give more players the ability to experience different sidejobs (e.g. Detective) and different abilities (Coordinator/Dispatcher) which makes playing cop fun. Locking them behind only makes people less likely to play police in the first place. The inability of trainees to place barriers or even have a shotgun compared to the normal PC Officer spawn is just silly.

*The criminals in cop groups problem; this is directly from GM. Not quoted but something like the following is written down somewhere. A group maybe not be some sort of squad for criminals. And the other way around it's also not possible.

Yeah I'm aware, hence why I said people don't play as cop more often. There isn't anything to get your attention/interest. A lot of people used to join DE as a criminal, then switch to cop side temporarily or permanently later. Nowadays there isn't anything like that, and no offence to SAI, but it cannot offer the same.

^ In effect the solution to why people aren't cops is multi-ended, and group managers are part of that long-term solution.

@Leonard I must say that in my own experience you're incorrect. If I see trainees running around and they are not gang members (who change their name which is incredibly dumb just keep your own nickname). I would teach them how to play the game introduce them to it a little. Find someone from their own country. Tell them what they should try to join if they want it. Just ask @dobroski I helped him when he first joined. Same with @nvidia.

I highly doubt this is true to be honest, perhaps not from you, but definitely from the cop side as a whole. It's no secret that the majority of gangs PM new players in an attempt to make them loyal and join the gang, most notably any of the 22 gangs Mrwan made, UE, sometimes Z & CripZ ... ThC and TT scout new players but rarely 'teach' them the game per se, I think only AA doesn't do anything in that sense.

On the cop side there isn't anything remotely similar. Nearly all squads refuse to engage with new players, whether they are trainees or otherwise, and ignore their existence. There's just a holier-than-you attitude that squads like SWAT / FBI / FOX are above standards and shouldn't recruit new players. You can even find the exact same words from FOX HQ Howlze in server echo, same was said by a mid level FBI member and from my own experience in SWAT I know we did the same.

Of course that means gangs will pick up new players instead, including trainees, so there's rarely anyone ever who joins a squad as a new player. The days of SAPA are long gone, and I would comfortably say the death of SAPA is one of the reasons why cop side began to die in general. There's nothing to get involved in as a new player if you're willing to become a cop, so you end up in the gang side instead.

[Pancy]

My situation is a bit different, I've been a criminal all my SAES life ( been around since 2012). This month, I decided to change things up and join the cop side since I realized I wasn't having fun on the criminal side anymore. I have to say, I am having a blast, you have to be more clever and tactical as a cop, and you have to learn to play together since you are outnumbered all the time in pretty much every situation. That makes it fun for me, but the downside is that cops are very dependent on criminals, we pretty much have nothing fun to do if there are no active criminals whereas they can even have more fun and make more money if there aren't too many active cops around. I feel like just that reason is enough to push new people to go for the criminal side.

[Pancy]

@immortal said in GM Questionnaire: Why are you not a cop?:

Give squads the ability to turf and defending their turfs

I don't see how that would play into the RP aspect of the game, why would squads hold a turf?
Tho maybe what can happen is squads can be able to neutralize turf zones. Make them have an almost transparent blue color. Idk, just an idea :man_shrugging_light_skin_tone:

[RazorBlind]

cuz fuk da copz getoutta here

[moley.]

@razorblind said in GM Questionnaire: Why are you not a cop?:

cuz fuk da copz getoutta here

sheeesh :drooling_face: