[SUGGESTION] Make Squads requirements a bit lower

[Rasta]

Well as the title says, I'm here to suggest lower requirements than there are atm for squads in order to make people able to keep their squads and try to balance SAES gameplay.
There has been some squads closing cause of the activity showing and this could help balancing a bit the server. I think everyone can win with this (cops can have their squads and show the acitivity required and criminals will have more cops to fight)
Something has to be done to try to balance the gameplay on SAES. It's very unbalanced the way it is right now.

Please dont vote no only because you are criminal, vote with the thought of balancing the community!

State your opinions on the comments!

[Asexyno]

I agree, copside deserves a place in saes 100%

[Xavier]

I agree but i also think that gang requirements should be slightly higher especially on the higher levels since we have way too many gangs right now. It feels weird saying this while i'm a member of a level 1 gang but i think that's the way to achieve balance between both sides.

[moley.]

See criminal side also cares about the cop side

[Aurora]

I agree with what Xavier states, with the sheer amount of players who yearn for the crime and glory it's easy to get a gang up to official status. On the contrary, squads have such a high requirement with a low player base that it's rough to get stability. Take the Texas Ranger Force and Emergency Task Force for example - both had promising starts but due to complications they were both closed down. By lowering the requirements, it could very much appeal to the new players as they see all of these opportunities for squads and what they hold - while veteran players can get their squad up and ready while providing an extra support line for the policing field.

[Howlze]

I agree.

This is a previous topic that finally needs to see the light again. The requirements for squad activity is simply too high. There's an ongoing cop to criminal ratio of 1:5 on the server, despite that ratio, our requirements are still very much alike.

This topic was discussed a couple of weeks ago, where the answer was (to cut it down): No, no changes will be happening. We find it fine, that there is a maximum of 3-4 squads, of which don't have to be level 5.

We have lost too many squads already with Five-0 and ETF giving up due to the excessive requirements for squads. It is time for these requirements to change.

I do not think the current requirements are fair, nor appropriate for the future of SAES:RPG in terms of official squads. We currently have 4* official squads who are in combat against 16* official gangs. This is not OK and not how the ratio should be.

It is time for a change.

(*) approximate

[Skerdi]

While I agree with the idea, I think the problem is more complicated, basically everything a squad member can do, can be done by a trainee, even by a gang member that only has to spawn as one( yes I know that he cant partake in brs and turfs, but you still get the point) to arrest some players and thats it. On the other hand, gangs can br, turf, gr( yeah, its dead I know) The main problem I have seen with cop life, is that it is repetitive, the only thing you do is arrest. Also the game we play is grand theft auto, a criminal game, many players will choose the criminal background. I think adding more activities for cops would be better(being able to raid bases, I dont know) Another event I have occurred is that players within police background join a gang, to be able to play together( going to srs together, organizing brs together etc).

[Bisollini]

Ye +1 for this , but also make the gangs requirments harder untill it becomes balanced.

[Spetnazz]

@Howlze said in [SUGGESTION] Make Squads requirements a bit lower:

This topic was discussed a couple of weeks ago, where the answer was (to cut it down): No, no changes will be happening. We find it fine, that there is a maximum of 3-4 squads, of which don't have to be level 5.

That's the most delusional answer I've ever seen. But oh well, if that's the attitude of the people in charge of the levels, then fine by me. Let's discourage people from making new squads. How are they supposed to recruit enough members to level-up, when 7 out of 10 players on the server chooses to play as crim. Then there's the issue of making people apply for your squad; You can apply for FOX, SWAT or a squad that barely lives up to the level 3 requirements. What do you choose? The level 5 ones would be my first choice. How are they ever going to live up to the requirements in the server's current state?

[AntiRug]

Sadly this server needed two perfectly good squads to die, in order to see that change is needed. Absolute shame..

[Vennelle]

@AntiRug said in [SUGGESTION] Make Squads requirements a bit lower:

Sadly this server needed two perfectly good squads to die, in order to see that change is needed. Absolute shame..

Still wont be changed tho

[Rasta]

@AntiRug Im sorry that your squad died mate. I havent been ingame recently so I made this based on forums.
But Saes needs a balance between both sides and I am trying to help with this

[Cappo]

I agree, though that won't be that big of a change within the cop side, as people will still rather to play as criminals, just because there's more things to do. I mean, if Player X is new in the server and has to choose if he would like to join a gang and do stuff together with his gang mates or do a squad that will easily get higher level.... well, in the current state, the answer is the first option, obviously.

Yes, I agree to do that, but temporary, till things get a bit better. As during that time, there could be things getting added for the cops side, yet still related with the criminal side. For example, there could be a transporting a vehicle (that can't be damaged and has a limited speed) from a PD to another, it can be triggered when at least 10 cops are grouped up in a PD. Thats just an example of something that can be added that could spice up the gameplay of the cops, as well as of the criminals.

One other thing that I notice within the cop side is the obvious seperation between each other. There is literally no team work within the squads, I also honestly haven't seen new players (that are spawned as trainees) getting that welcomed from the official squads. Maybe talking a bit more, showing some good attitude towards possible members, as well as doing stuff together (possibly doing squad trainings, where all official squads and cops can do stuff together to practice, while off duty), etc, might get the people interested.

[FTH]

30 polices VS 300 cirminals. This shows everything. +1 the idea.

[Rocoso]

+1, no matter how much skill you have. It will always be impossible to do a 3 vs 10

[Tut]

i don't think we need to step down on requirements, you just gotta be more ready to take on new challenges, something that the etf failed at as it seems. i also think we need to see more gamemode oriented additions to the server where criminals give cops a reason to intervene.
by simply lowering requirements you're not getting a perm solution... only lazier squads

[Bisollini]

I suggest to make the prize for arresting OB x2 and a CLO x3. Also to add a M4 to trainee spawns and maybe v8 police vehs for the ofs squads.

[bas260]

And let strap give you money when you catch someone speeding.

[Ramby]

The point is, this game/community feels like a second job at the moment. Especially when you have your own squad. At a certain point, you are thinking what the hell am I doing? You come back from work or school and crawl in front of your PC to get a higher level in a virtual game? I got other games that are less demanding and give me the same amount of fun or even more.

Also, I don't agree about lazy squads, etc. This game is made to have fun and not to constantly hunt for statistics and constantly trying to improve or gain more posts to become the best at posting activities as a group/squad or gang. Sure, I get a member can contribute with a few posts a month to a group or anything else. but lately, it's just outrageous what is going on.

I still remember NNB going downhill for a month and got instantly demoted to Lvl 1... Still have no words for that.

The copside will be a constant problem for SAES and until a proper solution is found, expect the server to be full of criminals on the back of a fucking picador trying to provoke cops to get something to do.

I think more people can relate to this.

I hope you agree with me @Vennelle @AntiRug

Regards,

[AntiRug]

@Ramby Everything you've written is exactly how i felt. Owning a squad basically forced me to grind saes to make it succeed. At some point, you do sit down and just realize how goddamn pointless it really is reguarding your real life. I never had any space to breath or take a break from the squad. Always had to deal with people leaving/joining and requesting stuff. Sertainly didn't feel like a game from the 2000' but more like a fulltime job.

[Teddy]

Decreasing squad requirements doesn't increase cop activity, it simply means there's higher level squads with more rewards easily.

There needing to be 10 instead of 20 members for a level 4 squad, doesn't mean that next month we're going to see a doubling of squad members. At the very least, decreasing squad requirements gives 0 help to squads like FOX and SWAT, so absolutely nothing changes. All it does in fact is make people more likely to make a new squad. Most new squads/gangs don't last very long, and a new one would pull people away from existing ones only to bring them back later. Most crims aren't interested in the cop side, so any crims that make a squad are going to be making it for fun then stop when the fun stops like Five-0.

Consolidation is not a bad thing, I don't see anything wrong with the cop side being reduced to a few professional squads so that they can be even more active.

Let's stop thinking that making the game easier for cops will mean more cops because we've done that many times (e.g. kill arrest, v8 for police cars/increasing police car speeds etc.) and it absolutely never worked.

I think the more important point here is that I've left SWAT almost 1.5 years ago - literally nothing has changed for cops since then in terms of their abilities. Cops still go to store robs, jail breaks and general patrols. Their gameplay is 100% reliant on crims getting wanted levels. There has been zero script additions. The gameplay simply gets incredibly boring after you're done kicking ass of moaning crims.

The game is unfriendly to people who start out as trainees. They don't even have access to /radio, and official squads stupidly don't want them to have it, so new people just switch to crim. Straight away you feel unwelcome and don't bother continuing.

The restrictions we made over time for spawning as warden/state trooper are stupid and should have been for reward purposes only like "Congrats, new spawn for so many arrests!" instead of "Ok, we trust you not to be stupid after 100 hours, have this shotgun on spawn." .. shotgun is literally a basic necessary weapon for cops. To not include it under trainee spawn is just insane. Especially since by default it does no damage and a new trainee will take days if not weeks to figure out what LALT does.

The BR meta has been completely broken and it works on two bases - either the cop side is dead, in which case bankrobs are unstoppable, or the cop side is active/normal, and bankrobs don't happen. I still remember laughing a long time ago in admin chat after the HLS bankrob changes a few months ago - when the cop side was relatively active 90% of bankrobs happen between midnight and 6am .. obviously this is highly unenjoyable for anyone who doesn't play outside those hours, whereas those cops who do have lots of fun. When the cop side was active there was once a 4-day period where not a single bankrob happened between peak hours of 12:00 - 23:00, because gangs couldn't be bothered with the likely fail. It's either incredibly unbalanced or incredibly unbalanced. The new trend of buying up houses to nolife spawning around banks has pretty much ruined it for all other cops.

Making things easier for cops, doesn't mean more cops. ETF wouldn't have survived anyway. For gang management purposes their leadership was relatively inactive. Creating a squad or gang on this server is unsuitable for anyone under 21 or even 18yo anyway cause of the time investment. Giving cops an incredibly OP water tank hasn't made cops more active. It just made seeing it incredibly annoying for any crim.

And lastly and most importantly, the suggestions that cops on the server give are honestly stupid and self-hurting. Take the most recent example of JB cooldown -- literally why. Instead of avoiding jailbreaks / jail area, cops who don't like dming around go to the jail area and die anyway, then moan. It's so easy to just .. drive around it. Jailbreaks are a major part of gameplay on SAES, without it cops are self-limiting themselves to SR and patrols only. You're literally giving yourself less things to do by choice.

Honestly just disallow arresting in & around turf wars in F1 and make a slight tweak to add Official Squads as a turfing team in the turf script, turfing is a major part of the server gameplay and giving cops more things to do like this is so simple since the script exists already. Just let cops make a turf neutral and give them money for it while giving them fun fighting for it with guns, it's so simple. I might be insane but I believe that you'd see a a huge increase in cop activity if that happened.

Otherwise any complaints about cop activity are a direct reliance on script development. Gameplay changes will do nothing other than shift the meta around.

[Teddy]

Also cops can't join groups like OB and CLO where a lot of fun is, instead being stuck with choices like DE, where they can't even spawn without permission or go AFK under threat of a kick. HLS is a mysterious group mostly based on your relationships to the people running it in FBI & SWAT - if your relationships with that circle isn't good, you aren't joining. Joe got HLS less than a week after joining the cop side, most cops outside of FBI/SWAT never touch the group after a year of playing as a cop. There aren't any other cop groups, so you're left with throwing an application to become a trucker in ALT and hoping for the best.

Like honestly, fix your fucking groups ngl.

[Tritosh]

Do you really think making it easier to start a squad and make it lvl5 gonna make the cop side more active?
The cop side is literally boring, arresting someone isn't challenging the whole side activity is repetitive, making things easier makes it more boring. There are tons of suggestions about some nice additions to both sides yet there are no scripters sadly.
Kain tried to buff it, by making it much easier yet ended up getting bored and went inactive

[AntiRug]

@Tritosh That's why it's gotta be changed. You saying "arresting isn' hard" makes no sense, because completing a BR against 10 cops when 100 crims are guarding it, takes no skill what so ever. It might be boring, but it's gotta be changed instead of getting ignored.

[Teddy]

@AntiRug said in [SUGGESTION] Make Squads requirements a bit lower:

@Tritosh That's why it's gotta be changed. You saying "arresting isn' hard" makes no sense, because completing a BR against 10 cops when 100 crims are guarding it, takes no skill what so ever. It might be boring, but it's gotta be changed instead of getting ignored.

It's never 10 cops.

A BR in SF bank with James online counts James as 20 cops, because of respawns. Crims inside don't have infinite or repleaceable health either, you finish with what you came with.

As a cop with a property near a bank you effectively have 1000+ hp for a bankrob. 2000+ if you're HLS.

[Ramby]

I readt the assay, but honestly the point of time consuming is the biggest issue for me.

I really like to be part of groups, but if that means my entire time that I play, I got to join in for every activity or make one. I'm pretty much done.

The moment I log in, mandatory this, spawn now! I just want to play for an hour or 2, have some fun and not record evey step I make on the forums to prove "we're active" .

Take it all less serious and keep the fun going. Instead of the 2nd job as it's now.

I also think that ages has nothing to do with it, but more the effort aka time you can and are willing to spend on it.